February 28, 2012
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No I don’t support our troops, why would I?
“It’s patriotic to support our troops!”
I can understand if you feel like that, but allow me to ask a single question, “why?” Why am I less of an American or less patriotic if I don’t support the people who are acting against my beliefs in almost every conceivable way? Why should I have to shut my mouth and “support our troops” even though I absolutely hate the fact that they are killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people?
Patriotism is being proud of the country you live in, proud of what it is supposed to stand for. Patriotism is trying to return our country to it’s former glory, it’s non-interventionist roots, trying to restore the dignity we once had, the courage and honor our military and our people once stood for. Patriotism is hard working Americans providing for themselves and their families, earning, saving, building and creating a better world to live in for future generations. I will NOT support a group of people who are directly opposed to those ends.
“But Jon, they just killed Bin Laden!!!”
Why should I care about that? Great, they guy is dead. But now they are going to use his death to incite fear in the public over blowback, you know, retaliation. They are going to fear-monger the hell out of us until we are begging them to put new restrictions on everything. “Freedom” is a word that is going to be used to describe a more totalitarian society of limited EVERYTHING. If you think TSA is bad, wait until we start putting checkpoints at the entrances of every major highway and on the boarders of every state.
“What about those who joined the Army and are against the war, or those that joined before it started?”
They don’t exist. I don’t believe anyone in their right mind would willingly join the armed forces if they were against the war, and everyone who was in prior to this war has had many many many opportunities to de-enlist.
“But Jon, there is something called ‘stop-loss’ that is keeping a lot of servicemen in the armed forces”
For 10 years? Improbable. Yes, it exists, but it extends your service in the military by 10-15 months, I stand by the previous comments.
“But Jon, They are fighting for our freedom! They are risking their very lives to protect us!!”
From what and from who? What freedoms were being preserved in Iraq? Which one of our freedoms is being threatened in Iran? Last I checked, the official reasoning behind our current occupations was to “protect our foreign interests” and NOT “to protect our freedom.”
“I just don’t agree, I think you have to support our troops even if you don’t support the fight we are engaging in”
Well, you are not alone. The government feels that way as well. They actually force me to give them money to support a war and a fight that I want nothing to do with. I have a choice, either hand this money over, or go to jail. Honestly though, most employers take your tax money before you get your check so you, literally, cannot chose the second option anyway.
I do not support our current occupation of foreign countries. I also do not support the troops who have voluntarily joined the forces to participate in these wars. I see no reason why I should support them. I see no logical argument as to why my lack of support is un-patriotic.
I also think the best way anyone can show their patriotism is by bringing our troops home and ending this mess we are in across the globe.
Comments (70)
I agree that we should not be doing a mindless Globo-Stomp, anywhere and everywhere. All the same, as long as there are thugs operating across national borders, someone has to act as a counterforce.
Real peace is a multi-faceted effort, and the Armed Forces, for the foreseeable future, are a necessary part of that effort. When the Ayatollah and the Taliban, etc., stop tossing sand in people’s faces, then we can more readily talk of pulling back.
Yeah, I don’t like most of what you’ve said here even though I respect your right to have and voice those opinions. There are many ways to act on your beliefs, most of them that involve complaining from the outside are impotent. Most of the people in the military would prefer that we have a different foreign policy and choose to bring that about by acting from inside the military.
They use us veterans and the soldiers like whores to get you guys to be patriotic to corporate agendas. They have that cliche, slogan “You don’t have to support the war, but support the brave men and women who serve,” and I was always like, WTF? They aren’t separate things.
If someone doesn’t agree with the war, they can leave. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientious_objector
I just wanted the money. I joined because my mom needed money at the time.
I ignore the bigger parts of the world.
Am I patriotic? Sure, I support our side because I want to eat.
They raised us white people wrong though. You really should be loyal to your country, even if it’s a wicked world.
Justfinethanku; the troops are fighting for the rights that you have (e.g.to speak freely). Is it their fault that an administration sent them to a land that has not been conquered?
Don’t kill the messenger. In other words; support the troops.They have your back. They are just taking orders.
You’re going to get hell from a ton of sheeple for writing this. I’m sure you know that, though.
I personally don’t care about people who are in the military anymore than the random person who installs my cable. They chose that career path, why should I give them a pat on the back for that? Getting drafted is another story. Those people were forced into it, they did not chose their path to Vietnam. It was kill or be sent to prison, which to me is absolutely awful. I’m sure that most people now do not understand why war is so bad because soldiers are glorified here for one reason or another. I bet if they brought back the draft people might feel differently about the war and our ease with sending young people to go kill others or be killed. It’s disgusting the amount of blind patronage that goes on in this country.
(p.s. to those of you who disagree with what I said, that’s great, but don’t bother responding. It will be a waste of time as I will not read it. Have a nice day.)
@Kellsbella - Well, yes. They chose to join up knowing that they probably would be sent off to fight. Also, land that has not be conquered? Seriously?
As a foreigner, I see the adoration of the military in America, which to outsiders is obvious, as a precursor to fascism. Take care, my colonial friends.
Back in the 60′s organizations sprang up in Canada to aid conscientious objectors. Some are still flourishing today because it seems the U.S. is ‘at war’ somewhere on the globe all the time. Now however, you don’t have to be a draft dodger to be welcomed to Canada through these organizations. You only need to be a citizen, like you, fed up with the military policies of your country. So if you ever need to ‘get out, or just get away’, there’s lots of room in Canada!
I ‘support my troops’ and even yours, even though I don’t believe in their involvement in some places. But I’m old fashioned. I support them because I believe in the root cause of their raison d’etre………..keeping my country free and safe. I have however, two sons whom I have talked out of joining the military a number of times. I will NOT have them fighting for a cause that has more to do with ‘the war machine is GREAT business’ than it does with freedom.
@Saridactyl - When? Occupation and conquering are completely different. I suppose you’d prefer we revert to the “draft”? Give credit where credit is due. You’re placing the blame on the people doing the dirty work and not the leaders. Pity, on you I say. Here, I’ve got a special little sumpin sumpin just for you (if your attention span can withstand the 5 or so minutes) I truly hope you will see the sacifice that our troops have made: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA74zknxxcs&feature=fvsr
@Lovegrove - We need to take especial care, my luv, for we have King George, er, Obama who has bi-stepped the Constitution on several occasions. Then again, perhaps I could get a (unappointed by Congress) media tzar position and just spin things so that people will feel happiness and joy. Yes, and Twinkies! They must all have Twinkies!
@DivaJyoti - It never ceases to amaze me how many people assume that everyone in the military is a blind order-obeying tool of the imperialists. Most of the people I know in the military would like to see the military being used to protect the actual borders of the US and leave other nations to police their own countries, but still understand that sometimes fighting there means not having to fight here and there has to be some kind of balance. And they’re still willing to do it even though their service is misunderstood.
Best post ever. I myself am Anti-war, Anti-government. Free country my ass.
@DivaJyoti - Thanks for your service.
What is absurd and monstrous about war is that men who have no personal quarrel should be trained to murder one another in cold blood. -Aldous Huxley This quote says it all.
@DivaJyoti - Very true.
Jon, I am grateful
that we live in country where you have the freedom to publicize that
you do not support the young men and women who risk, and sometimes lose,
their lives to assure that you continue to have the right to express
your disdain towards them. As you mature you will no doubt develop the
discernment to distinguish between the self-serving office holders who
declare war and the often well intended but politically misguided youths
who fight them. Yeah, I know…you are way smarter than they are and
you would never be “duped” into fighting an old white man’s war. But is
there anything that you believe is worth killing for? Nothing is worth
dying for, I’ll grant you that, but some people need to be
killed…sorry in advance if that makes you wince.
I travel extensively and I am sometimes out of the country for months at a time
but I know where my home is and I know its worth. If there was
something better “out there” I would have found it and I would be living
there. Open your eyes. Pay attention.
@Crying_In_Color - who’s asking for sympathy? I’m just pointing out that we WILLINGLY make sacrifices so naive little girls like you can have the luxury of your ungrateful attitudes. You can disagree with our current war all you want, and you can even be anti-war.
Just don’t forget who secured and defended that right for you when the time comes…
@AgainstTheWind1 - I cannot personally remember back in the 1700s when the USA became a free country. Sorry. I will however remember the government that slowly began to take those rights away. ;)
@AgainstTheWind1 - Defending and securing our rights? The last time I checked the war was no longer about our freedom.
@Crying_In_Color - I’m curious. Our country has been attacked thousands of times since we gained independence. To take one example, with no provocation from us, Japan destroyed Pearl Harbor in 1941. Would you rather we had done nothing to retaliate and instead let ourselves be taken over by the alliance of Japan and Nazi Germany?
I think supporting your troops is a much different issue to supporting armed occupation of foreign soil. After all the main purpose of having troops is for protection of your country and it’s citizens.
@Pickwick12 - Read this http://www.pearlharbor.org/history-of-pearl-harbor.asp
@Crying_In_Color - I’ll agree to disagree, since I can’t agree with your perspective on this. Thanks for the discussion. It just makes me want to be more grateful to the men and women who risk their lives for me daily.
@Crying_In_Color - yes dear, but we’re not talking about the war. We’re talking about the troops. I don’t have time to further this discussion, so I’m just gonna wish you a good evening here.
I can tell you one big fat reason why. Their existence is why we have not been invaded many more times than we ever have, and why we remain free. There are people in this world who have armies at their command, who would take us over if there were no threat from the military. Their presence keeps you safe.
@AgainstTheWind1 - @Kellsbella - @blonde_apocalypse - Ditto.
@mtngirlsouth - I always thought that was because we are the only military presence to threaten and actually use nuclear weapons. That’s a pretty big deterrent.
@DivaJyoti - I don’t despise them. I just don’t think any differently of them than I do anyone else. I don’t think our government or the military leaders do, either. I think they use the whole hero perspective because it’s appealing to people who feel helpless and their only choice is to join the military. They lie just to get kids fresh out of high school to join in something I don’t think they really understand. I do despise those who have been caught doing atrocious things, like the troops that were posing in photos with the people they had just killed. Or the ones that burned the Qur’an. I have no respect for those people.
I personally do not agree with war or senseless killing, which in my opinion, is a lot of what the military is doing currently. I know plenty of people who are in the military because they had no other choice and they hate it. They hate what they have to do, but they have no choice or they’ll be dishonorably discharged or thrown in jail. Just because they don’t want to kill people.
Agree and disagree. I don’t support any sort of killing, fighting, war, or anything else that goes with ones general prototype image of what “troops do.” That being said I’ve had many friends go out and work in ways that aren’t as destructive (I have a friend who is a medic) and in that sense I can support because I know that he is going out there to do something that is necessary in these times. Otherwise I offer a big sigh towards the whole subject. I think the blind “support” can be damaging. I don’t support the thing as a whole. I don’t support “soldiers” but I support the people in the uniforms who are human and believe that what they are doing is right I suppose. Spare those who are actually whacko, but that goes for any human being military or not. Thanks for getting me thinking I suppose.
The issue is your presidents (dem and rep) and the people advising them.
Not their soldiers.
I believe this is at least… semi-accurate, (I’m not American, I didn’t study their history and to be honest, I don’t care that much)
http://tekbullsidebar.tekbull.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Wars-e1312518055191.jpg
Wither or not the war is about our freedom the fact we support the troops and pray for them because they are following orders they are doing their duty and we as citizens of the United States should stand behind them and support them all the way
Non-interventionist roots? Lols. The US has been an imperialist power since Roosevelt #1, and an expansionist nation since 1803.
The mantra “support our troops” doesn’t make much sense to me either, but I have to admit, it takes a lot of courage to put your life on the line like that. Don’t blame the average soldier for the war itself; blame the higher-ups.
Always support your troops and your breasts. Wise words from my grandmommy.
@Pickwick12 - I’m not sure that Pearl Harbor was unprovoked. FDR ran and won on a platform of not getting us involved in the war, something he claimed Hoover would have done. He also ran on a platform of non-intervention in the marketplace, something he claimed helped cause the Great Depression. On both of these promises he defaulted. He turned out to intervene in the markets to a great extent AND get us involved in the war. A quick internet search shows that he got us involved in the following ways:
1. Make an arrangement with Britain for the use of British bases in the pacific, particularly in Singapore.
2. Make an arrangement with Holland for the use of base facilities and acqusition of supplies in the Dutch East Indies.
3. Give all possible aid to the Chinese government of Chiang-Kai-Shek.
4. Send a division of long range heavy cruiser to the Orient, Phillipines and Singapore.
5. Send two divisions of submarines to the Orient.
6. Keep the main strength of the U.S. fleet now in the Pacific in the vicnicity of the Hawaiian Islands.
7. Insist that the Dutch refuse to grant Japanese demands for undue economic concessions, particularly oil.
8. Completely embargo all U.S trade with Japan, in collaboration with a similar embargo imposed by the British empire.
The government mythologizes our intervention as “waking a sleeping giant” etc. Pearl Harbor was certainly NOT unprovoked, and there is a lot of good reason to believe that our air force equipment was arranged in such a way as to promote the more panic than would have been the case if FDR disseminated life saving information in a more timely fashion.
Unfortunately soldiers don’t fight for freedom and liberty, their very paychecks are a denial of liberty to those who produce. It is always the young and naive men who subjugate and terrorize the world at the behest of the old and political. The women and children of the countries we attack are the victims of this terror. Innocent victims.
We have a terrible lack of rational ethics in this country and our adoration of the troops is a part of it.
@Slag_Runner - For the record, he did not say anywhere that he “disdained” them, he simply said he doesn’t support what they do.
“Nothing is worth dying for, but some people need to be killed.” I hope you realize how contradictory that is… Perhaps the people that our troops are killing feel the same way. And who are you to decide who should be killed? Why should the government or anyone decide who should or shouldn’t be killed?
There are many reasons someone might choose to enlist. I can’t think of one myself, but I’m not 18 or 20 years old. I’m 52, with some practical life-experiences, and I’ve had a lot more time to observe the world. I can’t ridicule someone who does, because he/she has a right to choose what they do with their life, even if I’m a father, with a son or daughter considering entry, I would have to support their choice to some extent, whether I agreed or not.
I know the US military is in way too many countries, and I do believe we can cut huge amounts of military spending, and still be truly safer. The fact is, the military overwhelmingly support Ron Paul, who is calling for an end to this madness. Inside the system, the enlisted are supporting a peace-monger.
@TheyCallHerEcho88 - Thank you for rising to Jon’s defense, it helps to illustrate that sometimes alliances are formed causing non-belligerents to be drawn into frays that they did not initiate.
I stand by my use of the word “disdain”. My read of Jon’s sentiment, as expressed in the comments he made, is one of disrespect and dismissal. If he would like to rephrase his comments to articulate his respect for American troops and his admiration, esteem or praise for them (all antonyms for disdain) then you and I could both agree that perhaps Jon does not really need for you to defend or interpret him.
No contradiction in one being willing to kill for a cause but not die for one. Dying is non-productive ( I am an atheist but I posit that it is equally non-productive for a person of faith).
I can not speak for the feelings of our troops, one would have to ask them on an individual basis what they are feeling.
And the next time you are confronted by an armed intruder in the dark hallway between your bedroom and the bath at 04:00, get back to me on who needs to live and who needs to be killed. Cheers…seriously, thanks for your comments.
@Slag_Runner - In much the same way as I would not support the actions of an addict who steals to fuel his habit I do not support the actions of any service member as a group or as an individual. Distain is the correct word for what I feel towards their actions, towards what they voluntary stand for but not how I feel towards they as individuals. I love my country, but I will NEVER support or endorse the mistakes it makes. Our troops haven’t fought for our freedom in decades and anyone who pays attention knows it. Including the troops.
I suspect the vast majority of commenters have read the title of this post, skimmed the contents (if they did that at all) and posted what they felt was an appropriate response. I can’t blame them, at one time or another I have done the same only to go back and realize I had no idea what the author was trying to say, or that I had put words in the authors mouth.
@Slag_Runner - No contradiction? You say that it’s perfectly acceptable to take a life, but that it’s unacceptable for someone to try to take your own life… Basically, you’re labeling them as “evil” for trying to take your life, but you should be praised for trying to take someone else’s life– I don’t see how that’s not contradictory. You really can’t empathize with the people on the other side of the war? They are people, too, perhaps fighting for reasons that they believe are worthy, or because they were forced to fight, or because they are trying to put food on the table.
P.S. I really am not willing to make the leap to an intruder in my house, because THAT is what has absolutely nothing to do with this blog.
@justfinethanku - Uh… not sure if you’re referring to me, but you recommended my comment, and I did read your whole blog… I was commenting on the fact that you didn’t specifically say that you had disdain for servicemembers, so it’s wrong for someone to infer that you do.
@TheyCallHerEcho88 - I wasn’t referring to you! Sorry if it sounded like that.
@justfinethanku - Thanks for owning your disdain. I can not speak for the vast majority of commenter. I have not polled them. I read the post and provided MY comments. Cheers.
@justfinethanku - No problem, I was just a little confused.
@Casey James Sonnier@facebook - well said.
My husband signed up for the military because he wanted to help defend our country after 9/11. The fact that the military would pay for his college tuition was a nice benefit. For many, the military is an opportunity to get college paid for, a degree, and lots of real world experience that translates over well into the civilian side once you’re out and looking for civilian work. To a lot of people, the military is a way to accomplish those goals without going into thousands of dollars of school debt. I know people who keep re-enlisting just because they can’t afford health insurance otherwise and simply need a stable income because of the state of the economy.
Military families make a lot of sacrifices. For that alone, I respect them and the solider in the uniform who goes wherever Congress and the President make them go.
The fact that soldiers are overwhelmingly in support of Ron Paul, who wants to pull back our troops from around the world, speaks volumes about them I think.
@Slag_Runner - You’re a douche.
Very interesting. I cannot decide whether or not I agree, but you sure as hell made me think. You have some big ass balls to be admitting this. *high fives*
What I do know is that I think it’s really sick how politicians can put young men and women in a war they wouldn’t put their own kids into. I totally agree with Ron Paul concerning that.
@Colorsofthenight - That is a good point- it’s such a stigma to be against the people who carry out the agenda, and so often hard to differentiate between the two when you are. It’s very very sick. LIke in my last comment- if a politician won’t let his own kid go to war, and willingly chooses to go into one, he’s a hypocrite.
i agree. i really don’t see soldiers as anything special, especially since they volunteered to do what they do. and, having had a ton of friends and significant others in uniform, i can testify to one thing: they’re all assholes just like the rest of us. they aren’t really anyone special or more worthy of respect.
Of course you should support the troops. They are defending (even if indirectly) your right not to support them. I joined the Navy in 1994 because 1) I wanted to serve my country. 2) I want to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. 3) The G.I. Bill was going to be a nice thing too.
I did not joint to harm people or cause any harm to anyone and I never did (aside from indirectly killing birds while flying in planes). I joined under Bill Clinton right after the 1st Gulf War so I did not go to “war” in any sense. However, I do not think I’d do well in combat type situations so I chose a job and branch of military where I would not be expected to fight. The squadron I was attached to did counter drug operations, protected Iceland per our agreement with them since they have no military, and we helped to find evidence against Milosevic. Now, if that’s something you cannot support I don’t know what is wrong you. The military does a hell of a lot more than just fight wars. Who do you think helps to bring sickos like Milosevic (who committed genocide) to justice?
Now, if you want to complain about various campaigns, by all means do so. I will continue to complain that Bill Clinton decided not to intervene in Rwanda in 1994 when nearly 1,000,000 people were murdered in only 100 days. That haunts me to this day just as much as civilian deaths in Iraq. In these situations there are no real, right answers. So, if the above numbers are correct and there are 100,000 non-combatants deaths in Iraq since 2002 that’s still a better number than one million in 100 days. Sad… wish there were better solutions when mass murders happen (Kurds in Iraq).
Itz almost refreshing when someone says this openly. I want us to lose the war yet i suport the troops has always sounded like lying bullshit to me
I don’t like the Middle Eastern wars. I think if we left those people along, they would eventually all kill each other. But, if you pulled all US troops back to the US, something very bad would happen. All the crazies could run wild without being afraid of anything. Russians could sell their leaky old A bombs to any wacko with a few bucks. Chaos breeds chaos. And those hundreds of thousands of returning service people will be wanting jobs and housing and medical care….Lots of consequences. There are no easy answers.
Keep not supporting the troops who are building schools and hospitals in Iraq. And what, exactly, do you propose we do with the returning vets? THERE ARE NO JOBS. For some of these guys, the military is all they’ve got.
PS: I don’t support the occupations either, but the alternative- with the crazies running the Middle East, is far worse from a humanitarian perspective. Look at Libya before Qaddafi was deposed. Look at Syria now. Or Egypt.
I read this and think, “oh children.”. The world we live in costs not a penny, but if you want to eat, well, that is a lot more than a dime. There was a comment about not remembering the 1700s when our freedom was gained. Do you remember any of the terrorist acts committed on this soil, at all? Why do you think those happened? Why do the philipines want our military base to return if we are so terrible? Maybe if the kids looked at their history, they would understand more about the world and how it works. But attention span is low and desire to self educate in things outside of pop culture seems to wane ever more. So we hang out in hot water like frogs oblivious. If we were to be passive as some of these kids believe we should be, we would all be floating face down.
I appreciate what our service men and women have done.
I have a brother who has been in the army since somewhere around 2004. I don’t know exactly when, but I know it was before Katrina. Enlisting was the best thing for him. He didn’t really have a lot of friends in high school, kept to himself, had to graduate with a minimum credit plan because he was struggling in one particular subject. Now he loves showing everyone his awards and coming to Thanksgiving and Christmas in is formal Uniforms. Dorkus even plays beer-pong every now and then. My brother isn’t in Afghanistan particularly to fight. He’s there to do his job, away from our little town of 1.8 square miles, ‘playin’ Hurt Locker in the desert’ as he says.
My husband joined the military in 2002 mainly because of how it would help pay for his schooling (he was planning on going to Brown University). He told me that a recruiter had visited his high school right after the 9/11 attacks and the recruiters were (naturally) glorifying the benefits that you get out of being in the military. They also told him that if he joined the army national guard that he wouldn’t be deployed to Iraq. Obviously all of those were lies. He was in a near death accident in 2003 and finally medically retired in 2007 after a long battle with the military. To date, he hates the military and anything to do with it because of the way they treated him. I know that not all people in the military are liars, evil, etc etc…but a lot of them are. My husband told me all the horrific stories of what everyone had to endure while going through training…basically trying to brainwash them into thinking that everyone in Iraq/Afghanistan deserve to die. Fortunately, there are some decent people that don’t buy into that and really truly try to help the innocent civilians.
I still have mixed feelings about the military because I know what goes on, but I do respect those that truly want to protect us and actually want to do some good. However, I don’t respect those that all they want to do is kill people (like 2 of my exs) just for the fun of it.
there are troops and there are troops. young people join the military for many reasons. some join during peacetime because it’s their best chance toward a better future. military recruiters are known for making promises and painting rosy pictures they know aren’t going to come to pass for 95% of the young people they convince to join and let’s face it. someone who is 16,17, 18, 19, 20, really has no clue about what’s going on in the world. most adults haven’t a clue about politics beyond the sound bites they’re fed if they happen to turn on the news when they return from work. war is literally hell and breaks out after everything has failed and there are no real winners. it’s the schoolyard fight on a grand scale. still, i don’t blame the kids who sign up except for the crazies who sign up because they want to get out there and kill for the sake of killing. what is important and needed more than anything in this world is relentless untiring dialog between countries if that’s what it takes to create trust and mutual respect. hawks consider this appeasement. no, it’s courage, intelligence and wisdom. yet if someone is slaughtering people that person needs to be stopped by anyone who can do so.
in 1997 i became good friends with a former covert operative who lived in my building. this guy was intense. during the time i knew him he had a phone conversation with a General at the Pentagon. they were friends but they had a disagreement over the appointment or promotion of someone. the General said to him, “Well, cream rises to the top”, to which my friend answered, “Just remember. Cream isn’t the only thing that floats.” haha. i loved it but i digress. one day this friend told me Osama Bin Laden is the most dangerous man in the world. my answer was “Who?” turned out he was right. that Bin Laden used a handful of men to hit the U.S. hard at the heart of our economy and nearly hit us at the heart of our military was strategically brilliant. that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz furthered Bin Laden’s cause of hitting us where it would do the most damage, our economy was stupid, to put it nicely. still, i don’t blame the young men and women who enter the military on the promise of a better future. i only wish there were enough grownups around to let them know what they are really getting themselves into.
@SKANLYN - Aw jeez!!
@SasGal - That was very poetic!
@HelloRoxyy - He sounds like a good man. And YOU are a beautiful bride!
@DrummingMediocrity - Thank you so much!! I really appreciate your kind words
Soldiers don’t set policy, politicians do. This is like hating a cop for reluctantly enforcing a bullshit law instead of the politician that made the law.
@agnophilo - its actually JUST like that.
Interesting…in short, I will always support our troops. In my personal opinion times have change and I really think we the people are being fooled. The majority of folks joining and who are already in did not join for the soul purpose of hurting anyone. Our military men and women are of the people of the United States and then… you have the government who like the presidents are pretty much the puppets, strings being pulled by a group of folks who have a different agenda. I don’t see why anyone should or shouldn’t support they are us. But if you choose not to that does not make you less Patriotic (just make sure when the time comes if and when we have to defend the flag on this land you’re not hiding suckuh lol).
@SKANLYN - Thanks for your sophomoric ad-hominem contribution to the conversation. I enjoy intelligent discourse wherever I find it; in a bar, a cafe, a subway car or on-line. I seek out dialogue with people of all ages and backgrounds…it’s one of the ways I grow and learn. But I am also shallow and selfish. I have come to recognize that when the person from whom I solicit meaningful, reasoned opinions resorts to name calling it means they have exhausted their ability to contiribute. I discard those people like a used Kleenex. If you have something interesting to say, I’d love to hear it. Cheers.
@Crouchingbigtoe - will do, and with pride.
@Slag_Runner - Whatever old man. Your patriotic sentiment and support for serial killers employed by the U.S. government is both arrogant and barbaric. It’s people like you that cause the rest of the world to hate us and encourages terrorists to attack us.
@TheyCallHerEcho88 - Whoa! You have me chuckling here. You objected to my interpreting Jon’s comments as disdainful when he did not use the specific word “disdain” in his blog entry and then he was kind enough to acknowledge that he does feel disdain for their actions. Case closed.
Your articulated regard for precise word choice in Jon’s post did not carry over to my comments, however. I did not say “it was perfectly acceptable to take a life” I said some people need to be killed. The armed intruder in the hallway of your home at 04:00 is only one example of such a person. Dismiss the notion as related or unrelated to this post as you choose, but I believe you would agree with me that such a person needs to be quickly and permanently dealt with. One of you is likely to die in the encounter. If you accept that under the circumstances described, the intruder needs to be killed, than you can use your imagination to conjure up other real world examples to support my contention.
I did not inject evil into the discussioin. Evil is a religious construct and I would not say that the people who have in REAL LIFE attempted to take my life were or were not evil. I do not believe they were.
I have deep feelings for all combatants in an armed conflict. It is brutal, bloody business and impossible to visualize or imagine until experienced. It is tragic for all young men (and it has almost always been young men) without regard for the reasons that placed them in opposition to one another. You can accept that as genuine on my part or not.
And you missed a point. When I said nothing is worth dying for I was not referring to the odds of being killed in an armed conflict. I was referring to men and women who self immolate to aid their “cause”; men and women who strap 16 pounds of C-4 to their torso and detonate the charge in a crowded market, people who starve themselves to make a point. There are better ways.
Anyhow, thank you for your reasoned comments. I truly do appreciate the honestly held and well spoken opinions of other people who view our mutual existance from another angle. Cheers.
@Slag_Runner - it might have more to do with you conveniently implying I disdained the people and not just their actions. You’re twisting my words and making it pretty obvious.
And for Gods sake stop ending your greetings with “cheers.” It’s extremely condescending in the context and more than a little annoying.
@justfinethanku - I was NOT implying. Following your clarification I very specifically said that you “feel disdain for their actions”. I made no comment or suggestion as to your regard for the people. Take a look at what I wrote. No twist here.
For god’s sake? I will cheerfully dismiss with the use of “cheers” as a courtesy to you on your blog, but please, to suspend the use of a word as some form of propitiation to a mythical deity? A bit much wouldn’t you say?
You know, I would also prefer to just let them kill themselves off as well. But you know what else? Our soldiers have saved a lot of Middle Eastern children over there from very bad “civilians”. You don’t see that in the news.